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Cavaliers looking for answers, lose to Magic 99-89

I think the conversations about whether the Orlando Magic can finish can be put to bed.  We also are well aware that the Eastern Conference Finals are likely to go the distance.  That all said, we now have seen three games where the Cavaliers have some serious questions to answer.

Tonight's game was once again sloppy, filled with needless whistles and lacking of any kind of rhythm.  I never blame officiating, and I won't tonight, but for the record, to all the Magic fans that think the Cavaliers get the benefit of the calls, the foul disparity tonight was 34-23, the disparity from the free throw line 51-33.  I think the numbers kill your case.

As for the game itself, Dwight Howard was dominant, but also got himself into foul trouble again.  That is why this game is so troubling to me.  With Dwight Howard on the bench for most of the first half, only playing a total of 28 minutes, the Cavaliers took 25 threes.  The Magic took only 17.  That should never happen.  Remember, the Magic is the team filled with three-point shooters.  The Cavs game is drive and kick, and sure, the three ball is part of it but it cannot be the main ingredient.

Mo Williams and Delonte West struggled once again from the field, and it is obvious that the Magic defense, specifically the size of the Magic backcourt, is really giving the Cavaliers trouble.  West and Williams combined to go 10-27 from the field, a continuation of what we saw through Games 1 and 2.

It looked as though Mo was going to get his shot back until he was bloodied by an elbow from Anthony Johnson.  Johnson was levied a flagrant-1.  It didn't appear to be on purpose, but it seemed to have a lasting effect on Mo.

Zydrunas Ilgauskas has also been a non-factor, and his shot selection, going 0-3 from behind the arc, is simply unacceptable. 

As for LeBron, there is little more he can do to carry the Cavs.  Tonight was the night James struggled from the field, going 11-27.  He was able to go to the free throw line 24 times, hitting 18(75%), but his 5 misses in the 4th quarter were crucial in a series where every point has counted.

Conversely, Dwight Howard was able to hit his free throws, going 14-19. 

The Magic now lead the series 2-1.  Game 4 is Tuesday Night from Orlando.  The only real must-win game comes after three losses, but for Cleveland, getting Game 4 to take home court away from Orlando is huge.

It's a race to 4 wins, and the Magic are half way there.  Something tells me this series is far from over, but the Cavaliers need to get some of their mojo back.  During the Mike Brown era, that mojo has come from the defensive side of the floor.

GO CAVS!

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No way Mo, Delonte an Z keep shooting this poorly. We still got this series.

I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck

by Turkmenbashi on May 24, 2009 10:56 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

None of this tonight

Welcome to Smashville, Tennessee.
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Proud iPhone user. Take that, Jim Balls.

by Aditya T (smashville) on May 24, 2009 11:03 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Speaking as a neutral (AKA I'm not a troll)

I think the Cavaliers are essentially done. They’ve shut down everyone not named LeBron and that’s what is winning them the series.

For 3 games solid, nearly everyone not named LeBron James failed to show up on a consistent basis. What sticks out for me is not the poor point guard play, but the lousy big man play. How many years has LeBron been with Varejao and Ilgauskas? It’s like they’re practicing how to catch his bounce passes for the first time. Ilgauskas, fan favorite or not, is past his prime. Does he realize that the average 7+ foot tall center does not concentrate 80% of his time firing long range perimeter jumpshots and three pointers? Z must be afraid of going to the rim or something. Draw contact at least. And Ilgauskas’ defense on Howard is comical. His weakside help trying to block an outside shot is pathetic and half-hearted. Mike Brown should reduce his minutes significantly if not bench him outright.

Varejao must think he’s Chris Paul out there by going for these fancy extra passes instead of attacking that rim like Charles Barkley attacks the buffet. He’s way too inconsistent for me. This is something that needs to be addressed in the offseason.

I have a question, what happened to JJ Hickson? Don’t see him out there. Is he injured?

Now to the point guards. West, Mo, and Pavlovic have years to take a wide open shot and they’re missing badly. Just look at West in game 1 on the three. Wide open, same spot as his previous made three, and misses it badly. They’re getting tremendous looks at the basket and not converting.

Lastly, some of this has to go on Mike Brown. If he would just adjust (heh heh) every once in a while when the Magic are on a run instead of reverting to 2005-06, the series would be at worst 2-1 for Cleveland.

Again, I’m not a Magic fan, just throwing in my two cents. As soon as I saw that game 1 collapse I had a feeling Cleveland would be in big trouble.

Before I stop, the officiating has to be taken into question. 80+ free throws in a 48 minute game? Howard’s 6th foul was bogus as was Ilgauskas’. Let them play for crying out loud!

If I’m Cleveland, game 4 is their season. Gut check time on Tuesday.

Good night!

Seattle Seahawks: We've got Brian Russell and TWO kickers!

by SSreporters on May 24, 2009 11:05 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

By reverting to 2005-06

I mean “LeBron holds ball, take the shot clock all the way down and miss a shot”.

Seattle Seahawks: We've got Brian Russell and TWO kickers!

by SSreporters on May 24, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I can’t say you’re wrong about what has happened, but I think you’re wrong about what’s going to happen. We’re far from done. Game 4 is huge, but we’ve got a good shot. As I said above, I don’t think there’s any way our guards keep shooting that badly.

I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck

by Turkmenbashi on May 24, 2009 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Game 4 is a big concern for me as well Turk....

…not so much as i’m afraid the Magic won’t come out with full effort…but Turkoglu, Pietrus, and Alston have shown the can be streaky and prone to making stupid plays at times. As active as the officiating has been in this series…there are just too many variables that aren’t controlable other than playing good defense, give great effort and run the offense sets as consistently as possible whether we’re up by 10 or down by 23. Hopefully it will be a great game and the officials will stay out of it!!

"if you're going to cry...go cry to your mama"

by MagikFanatic on May 25, 2009 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

its not ova till the last second of th final game..we gon win tomoro and the next games at the Q..i dnt see cavs losin agen at the Q cos they kno homecourt advantage is eesential..

amazing happens here

by wine_gold on May 25, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This has to be a joke, right? Right?

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 5:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think his profile says all we need to know about him:

tryin to get to th nba by playin pickup games n for college team..

Good luck with that.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 5:38 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Game 3

I think the wives of the Cav’s came to play. I have never seen so many bricks thrown up in one game not to mention the vast number of air balls. Cleveland did a better job against the 3 point shot and was doing good on the rebound but couldn’t finish with points, we need someone else besides James to help this team.

by displaced on May 24, 2009 11:23 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

This is it. Orlando’s gonna score. Our defense wasn’t bad. But jesus, our offense…

I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck

by Turkmenbashi on May 24, 2009 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Turk ...i thought the Cavs would do more of Lebron driving and dishing underneath to AV, Ben, or Z.....

….or Mo or Delonte driving and dishing to a slashing LBJ. These to sets seemed to work as well as anything…i was a little confused …and happy of course..as to why M. Brown didn’t go to it more.

"if you're going to cry...go cry to your mama"

by MagikFanatic on May 25, 2009 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i’m really surprised by how little the the cavs’ guards have gotten into the lane. i feel like it’s there for the guards to penetrate and dish or attempt to finish, but they’re really doing almost none of that. and in crunch time, as has been pointed out, the offense is far too stagnant.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have a headache.

The Cavaliers that are playing right now are a nervous wreck.

One thing that really peeves me off in this game is how they left Rafer Alston WIDE OPEN for several 3s.

Our offense was like fwoop in and out, way off, and/or LeBron.

There’s not much else to say when everyone else has already said it.

Here’s to Game 4. It’s Where Amazing Happens.

But I don’t know how far you can stretch it.

by GekkouKitsune on May 24, 2009 11:34 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Raefer doesn't normally make those shots....

…as a Magic fan it’s been very unnerving watching him take them as well..lol. That being said….i don’t know why they have Lebron guarding his when his defensive skills and athleticism would be better taking on Turk 1-1. I don’t think you would see the same fouls Turk is getting when the Cavs try to double him off the dribble. Also…having West on Turk or Mo on Pietrus or Lee just creates more problems that Lebron slacking off Alston would potential help in my opinion.

"if you're going to cry...go cry to your mama"

by MagikFanatic on May 25, 2009 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

there have been more than a couple of instances in which LeBron was guarding alston, sasha was guarding lee, and west was guarding turk. that’s just insane to me.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 9:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

please tell me that the magic are beatable (without hitting miracle shots)…how on earth did they lose 20+ games this season?…its getting to the point where all we’ll have to look forward to is seeing if the lakers can give this stupid team a real beating…who can we add? what do we do? best record and the best player in the league isn’t enough to win a championship? what is?

The Cleveland Indians: Minor League Farm Team Affiliate of the MLB

by HireRockyColavito on May 24, 2009 11:48 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Don’t freak out yet, we’ve got tons more series to go.

I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck

by Turkmenbashi on May 25, 2009 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I cannot understand why....

….anyone who is a real fan of the NBA is surprised by this….

Cleveland had a great season, beat almost all the teams they should beat but could not (and cannot) beat the teams they need to beat. No surprise there.

Mo Williams went from being an average player on a bad team (Milwaukee) to an average player on a better ream. The fact he was even on the all star team had to do with Jameer Nelson getting hurt and feeling around the league that the Cavs had to be rewarded for a great first half. Can you, without lying or laughing say this guy will ever see another all star game? And really, come on, after Jameer got hurt everybody knew Rondo shoulda been the guy. Here is a list of PG’s playing in the east that are better than Williams without question right now (D-Wade excluded though he pops up as a starter on all star teams, and will continue to so he can continue to be in the future)-

Rondo
Rose
Jameer

And the list of guys that are close and will leap over Williams in the next two seasons

Felton
Chalmers
Stuckey

Mo Williams is TJ Ford without the charm.

Mo Williams…..the great pretender. even Rafer Alston holds his own against him….which brings up to……

Who on the Cavs (besides LeBron) whould even start on todays Orlando team?

Williams maybe….and that is a big maybe and that would be just as a seat warmer until next year when Jameer is back. Then Orlando has a deeper bench. Cleveland has the best player in the game….that is it. He may “find a way”, the guy is unreal, but it will take every ounce of his talent to do so.

I suggest this is no surprise. Every Orlando fan feared the Celtics far more than the Cavs and knew, get past Boston and we were going to have a very real shot at the finals. We chuckled when you took you two sweeps of bad teams as a sign that you were dominate team. Remember those headey days Cav fans? While you, the talk shows, Nike, and the media are blinded by LeBron the reality always was you were the underdogs here from the start. I laugh so hard every time i see those LeBron/Kobe ads, an example of marketing trumped by reality.

Waiting on LeBron and the Cavs

by Brutalfacts on May 25, 2009 8:12 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for you opinion, Magic fan. I’m shocked, shocked, that you think the Magic is better than the Cavs. Thanks for your objective opinion. And thanks for coming here to slam Mo Williams.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 8:16 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah....

……that was probably too easy. But he is your second best player and all…..a very sad comment on the state of the Cavs……

Waiting on LeBron and the Cavs

by Brutalfacts on May 25, 2009 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

OK, if you’re just coming here to slam the Cavs and their players please go away. We welcome intelligent basketball discussion but you’re just trying to pick a fight. Stop being a jerk.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 8:20 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

With all due respect to Cavs AND Magic fans (which I'm neither--although I admit I've rooted for Orlando all playoffs long)

I would rather have Jameer Nelson, Rodney Stuckey, Rajon Rondo, and maybe DJ Augustin than Mo Williams. That’s not to say Williams didn’t have a quality season, or that he’s not an above average player, but at the same time, I don’t think he’s an All-Star.

I think the fact this series is so tight is an example of how good both teams are; not how bad Mo Williams is.

But, if Cleveland wants to become that clearcut absolute favorite, than I think they are missing that 2nd star to go behind LeBron James.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i think part of the surprise, professor, stems from the fact that the cavs won 7 more games than the magic this year. said differently, in the 82-game regular season, the cavs were substantially better than the magic, that’s why people are surprised by the magic taking this lead. is that clear?

your assessment of mo williams is dead wrong, continues to chop at your already minimal credibility, and is clearly designed to inflame cavs fans. mo williams is much better than average, as evidenced by his 17.8ppg, 4.1apg, 47% fg%, and 44% 3fg% over 81 games in the regular season.

jameer is coming on strong, but he ain’t better than mo today…certainly not clearly. as well, rose is not a better point guard than mo is today. you just show your ignorance with this opinion that is backed by 0 analysis.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anybody that would rather have Mo Williams than Derrick Rose is ignorant IMO

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or put another way

Anyone who says that Mo Williams is a better PG is also ignorant in that assessment. Rose is already better than Williams today.

That is, however, not Mo Williams, or Derrick Rose’s fault. Different type of players and different type of settings. Comparing them is completely pointless.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ok…i mean, you’re wrong, but that doesn’t appear to stop you from flapping your gums.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No I'm not

Call up Danny Ferry right now and ask him who’d he rather have. IF he tells you Mo Williams, and he would because you don’t upset a player on your roster as talented as Mo Williams, then you know he’s lying.

Nobody in an NBA front office chooses a borderline All-Star over a young Many time All-Star/Franchise Player. Nobody. Not even Danny Ferry is that stupid.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yes, you are dead wrong, actually. by almost every measure, mo williams is a more productive player, today (which is what i said) than rose is. i said nothing about building a team, or who you’d rather have for the future…that’s obvious.

give a shot to reading the full posts of people you’re responding to.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ha

Mo Williams is that much better than Derrick Rose today? Ha, yeah right.

Rose vs Williams statistically.

Rose is a worse 3 pt shooter. And, at 20, vs Williams being 27, I’d hope so. Rose shoots a little higher from 2pt FG% (and overall) than Mo Williams does. Williams has an advantage at FT%, but they draw FT’s at nearly the same rate (Rose has a slight advantage there).

Rose is a better rebounder, and passer today. He also has a higher Assist to Turnover ratio.

Yeah, I take Derrick Rose. You can have Mo Williams. Today.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or Williams is 26 same difference really though

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

sure, same difference…or said differently, wrong. again.

so, the fact that williams is a MUCH better 3 point shooter is simply explained away by the fact that rose is younger? that makes exactly no sense. what it actually does is support my case that williams is better today.

per 36 minutes, williams averages 2 points more than rose. rose has the assist advantage, who cares about rebounds, and mo has a slight steals advantage. 91% FT is a huge advantage over 78%. the raw stats aren’t convincing one way or the other, and certainly are not convincing in favor of rose, as you claim.

importantly, though, for 2008-2009, mo’s PER (the most important value stat) was 17.25. rose’s was 16.05. higher is better, and this represents a significant difference.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

HA @ the most important stat

Un huh, and LeBron James is a goofy white guy.

the raw stats aren’t convincing one way or the other

Un huh, so it’s clear that Mo Williams is a better player today, eh? Hahahahahaha. Right as rain on that one. Good luck making that argument elsewhere. Good day.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

excellent points…feel free to offer a counter as opposed to simply quitting on a topic.

further adding to my argument, mo’s estimated wins added this season was 8.8, whereas rose’s was 7.5. considering the goal in basketball is to win games, i’d say this is a pretty telling stat.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah that's it

I’m quitting. An analogy for the rest of my life. I don’t argue with an arrogant Cleveland Cavaliers fan on the value of Derrick Rose vs Mo Williams today after stating my points (simple as they are).

Chatting with you has so been wonderful that the next time I want a lobotomy I’m going to come back and seek you out.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pookey...

i would recommend restricting your posts and replies to someone like Turk here…for the sake of your own sanity. While he is as ZEALOUS, LOYAL and OPTIMISTIC as ANY Cav fan here….he is also not blinded by that loyalty to hearing opposing views nor closed minded to simply differing opinions from his. You will find engaging him in conversation enjoyable, intelligent and perhaps enlightening at the same time as to what it is to be a Cleveland sports fan.

"if you're going to cry...go cry to your mama"

by MagikFanatic on May 25, 2009 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Turk isn’t the only objective poster here. Me and plenty others can talk with opposing fans about their team when they stick to making intelligent points and not bashing our team. Most fans here love good basketball talk and are willing to engage anyone as long as they know what they’re talking about.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And anybody who says that Mo Williams is clearly better than Derrick Rose does not show objective opinion

Even more so when you bring in PER, Win Shares and all the other wonderful metrics that the stat heads have brought us over the years.

That isn’t my opinion. John Hollinger would laugh at that comparison of Rose to Williams. It isn’t fair to either player, nor is truly reflective of the worth Williams as a player (more so Williams) or Rose.

It’s not like Williams was a good player when he came to Cleveland. He put up better stats in Milwaukee last season, and was a competent role player in Utah as well.

There was not a single mention of what Williams does as a player for Cleveland in that statement, nor was there any reason to bring Derrick Rose in the conversation. That isn’t objectivity; that’s blatant homerism.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’m not arguing one way or the other in the Williams v. Rose argument, I’m just saying that there are many people here who you can have intelligent, non-biased conversations with.

But I don’t know why you’re degrading PER and Win Share. What’s wrong with newer stats created by “stat heads”. As a baseball fan, I’ve been following sabremetrics for a long time and admire the great work those people are doing with stats. i’m glad that Hollinger and others are applying those principles to basketball. What’s wrong with using those stats in an objective argument?

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

There isn’t an argument in Williams vs Rose. Rose wins this because he’s a potential superstar and 20 years old. That ship has long sailed on Mo Williams. No shame in that. But, at the same time, saying that Mo Williams is clearly better than Jameer Nelson (No evidence of such), or Rajon Rondo (again-no evidence), or even Derrick Rose is not a reasonable argument.

Using PER to compare Rondo, Williams and Nelson makes sense. They all played on winning teams with better players. Using PER with Williams and Rose does not make sense. The metric fails there, and should not be used that way. The reason it fails there is that, unlike Rose, Williams is not the best player on the Cavs. Right? Rose is clearly the best player on the Bulls. Subjective and objective fact support this. Win Shares will not be equal by any such standard when Mo Williams plays for a team that wins 66 games and Derrick Rose plays on a team that wins 41 games. The situations are not similar. Saying Williams is better than Rose isn’t dumb; it’s plain ignorant.

What’s wrong with using those stats in an objective argument?

Nothing is wrong with that. Using Rose and Williams as comparisons, and saying CLEARLY that Williams is better than Jameer Nelson (he definitely is not better than Jameer Nelson this season when Nelson played—check the TS%, eFG% among other things and PER if you’re so inclined—small sample size blah blah I could do the same thing with Rondo).

But, this is where I get off the boat.

I didn’t degrade PER or Win Shares. I know what they’re used for, and they’re solid, and useful, metrics when applied properly. In the case of Rose vs Williams, they were not. Simple, peezy, yep n eazy. There isn’t objective analysis that could come up with equal value. Why? There isn’t equal value. Rose is CLEARLY more valuable. It isn’t based on his stats (which for a rookie PG are impressive), nor were they based on a playoff series vs Boston.

Here I’ll make this easy. LeBron isn’t better than Kobe, and Cleveland will lose to the Lakers cuz all their players suck and aren’t up to the level of LeBron James. There, now you have pointless and dumb analysis.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

OK thanks. LIke I said, I wasn’t getting involved in the Rose v. Williams argument (I haven’t looked at the state enough to say, but I know Rose is going to be very, very good). I just wanted to make sure you weren’t one of those people who degrades advanced metrics as something created by dumb “stat heads”. I couldn’t tell if your “wonderful” was sarcastic or not — my intial impression was that you were being sarcastic, which is why I responded like I did. But now I see that you clearly know what you’re talking about, and I appreciate your analysis.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fair enough

And I realize why you thought I was glib. Sometimes my responses take getting used to. Probably should have made it more mass worthy. So that was my mistake.

Good luck in the rest of the series. Like with the Magic, the Cavs will need that.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

a couple of things…firstly, you are bastardizing what i’ve said. at no point did i assert that mo is MUCH better than any of these other point guards. i did say that mo is better than both jameer and rose TODAY, and i stand by that. you keep going back to some fake argument that you’re having with someone who says it’d be a better idea to build around mo than rose. i even admitted that the “future” argument is sealed, it’s rose. but i maintain that TODAY, may 25, 2009, mo williams is a better nba point guard.

as well, your analysis of PER and “win shares” (the actual stat that i cited was estimated wins added, which is different) is not accurate. i’m not taking a shot at you, i just vigorously disagree with your contentions. PER is a per-minute, pace-adjusted analysis of statistical production. it is a very relevant comparison for players across all types of teams. you say that the fact that rose had to be the best player on his team makes PER a poor application for him…that’s actually the entire point of PER. i quote hollinger:

It’s a per-minute measure because that allows us to compare, say, Rasheed Wallace to Jason Maxiell, even though there is a disparity in the minutes they played.

further, estimated wins added is meant as a comparison over a “replacement player”, and is therefore applicable to both rose and mo.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

MF, I appreciate your support here, but as Brad mentions, there are many others here capable of having a good conversation. Seems to me pookey and Joey were just talking around each other here, and maybe should step back and take a deep breath before re-engaging.

I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck

by Turkmenbashi on May 25, 2009 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because they didn't have the weakest schedule in the history of the NBA.

Like the Cavs.

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

OK, this is just completely false. If you’re going to start making up things then your comments will be deleted and you will be banned. We expect intelligent discourse here.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

For the record, the Cavs’ strength of schedule was .498, so right around .500.

Why do you think you can make a comment that is blatantly lying?

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i’ve got the cavs’ schedule at .499…and the magic’s at .498. very interesting that the magic had a weaker schedule than the


weakest schedule in the history of the NBA.

/shakes head

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that’s just blatantly false. i didn’t think you could outdo the stupidity of the comment below, but you may just done it here. congrats, can’t wait to see what’s next.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Attention Danny Ferry

Folks let me explain this. The Cavs have surrounded James with shooters, well they’re not hiiting so what else can they bring? Umm, nothing really. Other than Mo no one can create their own shot. Z doesnt even post anymore, he’s a 7 foot 3 jump shooter, a 3 point shooter who has only made 15 all year so why is he shooting those.

Now Orlando has shooters too, the problem is THEY ARE TALLER than the Cavs. Orlando’s shooters are taller, more athletic and can post up the small Cavs.
Cleveland has got to acquire a taller shooting guard and move Delonte to the 6th man role like Ginobili. Only Detroit with Isiah and Dumars won with a backcourt that small.

The front court has all kind of issues too. Wallace looks like he became 40 years old overnight. He has no offense and isnt even blocking shots. Andy is not strong enough and has zero offense with LeBron getting him dunks. Zydranus I covered, he cant block shots and is a jump shooter now who is strangling the Cavs salary cap, and Joe is at the end of his career.

In this series I’d look at Wally, Kinsey, or Boobie if our starters keep missing, then I use Joe Smith more since he actually has a jump shot, and is Lorenzen Wright active? Then have him come in and hack Howard.
-———————

In the offseason, Z, Wallace, and Boobie are expendable. Gotta get a bigger shooting guard and more athletic down low or find a post player with a back to the basket game.
Here are some options.

Trevor Ariza- He is young, athletic, can hit the 3 and play defense. This could move Bron to the shooting guard since he handles the ball anyways.

David Lee- Another guy who can rebound and help down low.

Jason Kidd- He, Mo, and Bron would have 3 ball handlers on the court and Kidd is alot taller.

Marcus Camby- A shot blocker and rebounder the Cavs need. If Lebron is our leading shot blocker we have issues. Clippers will dangle him since they’ll draft Blake Griffin.

Zach Randolph- A player with a back to the basket game in the low post and can step out and hit 3’s. Clippers will dangle him also.

Tyson Chandler- A shot blocker and rebounder the Cavs need.

by Lefty3 on May 24, 2009 11:55 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Zach Randolph to the Cavs

That’s a pretty intriguing thought.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 1:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wonder how Ferry and company are going to approach this offseason (regardless of what happens over the following 3 weeks and change) and next year’s deadline assuming no major injuries occur. This year, they stood pat and hung onto Wally’s expiring contract as he was contributing and our bench was short at SG at the time.

Next, year, Wallace is in the final year of his contract, but so are Andy and Z if they take their options. Depending on what kind of player Hickson develops into next year (and assuming the back injury is not serious) and if Andy decides to enter free agency, they are going to have to make some move to get bigger. I think the odds of trading Wallace’s contract are much better than Wally’s had been this year (even though in the end he wasn’t moved).

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the Cavs would be insanely smart to try & get Zach Randolph

Yeah, he has his warts, but so does any star player. And, Randolph can’t get away with the same crap that he has in other places (mostly Portland).

Randolph may be the best player the Cavs could get in the off-season. But, at the same time, I doubt they will do it becuz of Randolph’s character issue’s.

I, too, wonder about JJ HIckson and think he could be effective this series against Lewis in particular. The Cavs have 3 terrible matchup’s (Howard, Lewis and Turkoglu) in which they don’t match up nearly as well with the Magic as a team of their caliber should.

I don’t know how acquiring Randolph would help Cleveland this series, but that’s up to Mike Brown to figure out. That’s why he’s a head coach after all.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 25, 2009 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

acquiring zach randolph would be a horrible mistake for the cavs. he plays no d, shoots non-stop (and a lot of really bad shots), has a horrible attitude, and is not very athletic.

aside from that, he’s awesome.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Absolutley.

Stat-Bo (as we call him) is the most hollow 20/10 you will ever see.

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gortat

Let me add this also to my post above. Why are the Cavs collapsing on guys like Gortat and leaving shooters open??

If Z cant guard Gortat then sit him. They are collapsing too much.

Folks the Spurs used to never leave shooters when they played the Suns. They made Amare and Nash beat them. Amare has a way better jump shot and free throw % than Howard so why do they let Howard get dunks, is he muscling are guys under the basket? Then our guys are weak inside like I said.

by Lefty3 on May 24, 2009 11:59 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Who was the aggressor tonight?

I’ll openly admit I’m a Magic fan, but I think we can all agree that the Magic were the more aggressive team tonight. That usually leads to more free throw attempts. The article points to the disparity in free throw shooting as being indicative of “fair officiating” but that’s hardly the scenario here. Charles Barkley, Kenny Smith, and Reggie Miller all commented on the horrible officiating tonight.

There were 6 free throws under a minute left where the Cavs fouled trying to extend the game. The Cavs strategy, furthermore, is to foul Dwight Howard whenever he is about to get a clean look. Those two factors skew the free throw shooting stats. If your strategy is to foul a guy and put him on the line (which it openly is the strategy), FT disparity is not indicative of officiating.

Consider these calls in the series: the 6th foul on Dwight Howard. One of the worst officiating calls in the history of the game. That call was made for no other reason than it was LBJ shooting and then flailing his arms. Nice acting job by the way.

Mo Williams throwing the ball at Dwight Howard.

There’s no excuse for officials to miss these two calls. Most of the things fans argue about are judgment calls, and it’s easy to feel like your team is on the short stick when it is your team. But to have three former NBA players all question the officiating is something legitimate, and when you factor in the above two “decisions”, perception begins to blend into reality.

by CaneGrad05 on May 25, 2009 12:28 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Whatever man, you haven’t been watching with open eyes.

by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Neither have you. That’s why I said most of what we will argue about will be judgment calls. Those two calls are not judgment calls. And it’s not just Magic fans like myself being upset- but 3 pretty damn good NBA basketball players saying something about it as well. Not to mention Henry Abbott, who is a pretty fair NBA writer.

by CaneGrad05 on May 25, 2009 1:16 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Mo “pass” was not, but there have been dozens of calls on the order of that foul on Howard, against both teams. Look at when Mo got run over, when he wasn’t even setting a pick, and they called him for an offensive foul. We can both pick and choose.

by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

DH should have gotten a flagrant on the Mo ball throwing play for contact to the head after the whistle. would have negated the technical on Mo and given DH another foul. That play actually favored the Magic.

Anyone who supports the Magic but complains about officiating should realize that DH NEVER leaves the middle of the lane. NEVER. not on offense or defense. This advantage would be like giving LBJ an extra 2 steps after he stops dribbling (insert snide remark that he already does this right here).

by fivekmd on May 25, 2009 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

come on dude

if you think dwight should have gotten a flagrant foul for a legitimate attempt at a block then rajon rondo should have been publicly executed for his fist to brad millers face. the refs suck no matter what team you cheer for and are making themselves far too relevant when fans should be talking about and enjoying the game being played. i dont think any team or players should be blamed for how frustrating the calls are except for paul pierce. he irritates me

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it wasn’t a legitimate block attempt. the whistle had already blown, the play was dead, mo was goofing around finishing, and howard totally unnecessarily popped him. i think that’s why mo didn’t get a t, b/c howard deserved some kind of t/flagrant, too.

the refs totally suck, but you’re wrong on this one. 80+ foul shots is pathetic, the refs need to swallow the whistles more than a little bit.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah i see what youre saying. rafer alston fouled james at about half court. i thought that it was a continuation block.

but given that it was not a continuation play, consider how often kevin garnett goal tends or blocks shots after the whistle on a non continuation shot. it’s just defensive intensity i guess.

i don’t think dwight meant to pat him on the head while he was trying to block the shot. he’s just a massive dude that is stronger and faster than any human should be (like lbj) but to say he deserved a flagrant just seems like too much when you consider the real flagrant fouls that haven’t been called this post season.

how do you feel about the a.j./mo scuffle?

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i’m not convinced howard deserved a flagrant, either, so the fact that they let both mo and howard get away w/ what they did sits ok w/ me. although, i have to say, anytime players of this size and strength start flailing wildly around the head area, the officials/league have to be very careful about policing. can’t have that.

personally, i believe that just about everything these guys do (save a truly inadvertent howard elbow to c. lee’s face) has a large share of intention. i do not think that aj’s elbow to mo’s face was purely accidental. i’m not accusing him of trying to hurt mo, but that elbow came up with the design to make space/send a message…whatever. these guys are such phenomenal athletes, i find it impossible to see how, except in the extreme, they do things accidentally.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i dont think the cavs or the magic play dirty like the celtics or the pistons circa 2003-2008. those are the types of physical teams that seem to attack with intent and can get people hurt.

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah, i don’t think so, either. and i’m not saying that aj was trying to land that elbow, but it came up and in on purpose. that i’m sure of.

by the way, that did some freaking damage, man. mo had cuts above and below the eye…that was ridiculous.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah that was freaking crazy.

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The 6th foul on Dwight Howard...

…WAS THE WORST CALL OF ALL TIME! And I’m a Blazer fan! (That’s saying a lot). It dwarfs every other bad call made this season, much less in this series. If LeBron doesn’t win it this years Cleveland fans, say bye-bye. They’re finally building an arena in Brooklyn. Hov!

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

this is the dumbest comment i’ve read in a while.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i agree, and i’ve read LOTS of dumb comments lately.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

[deleted, troll]

Any comments that are provacative in nature and just trying to start arguments will be deleted.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yow.

You guys think I’m provacative? Is this the first time you’ve heard that LeBron may be out as a free agent in 2010? This is a basketball sight and that is the business of basketball. Provacative would be more like personally insulting you guys, like calling you names (troll).

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Saying LeBron WILL leave in 2010 is false. You don’t know what he’s going to do. And that’s not the discussion we’re having now.

Add this to the blatant lie you posted above about the Cavs’ schedule and you’re not giving a good impression here.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It’s also irrelevant when we’re discussing the 2009 playoffs

by SanD on May 25, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

no, we’ve heard that he may leave. but you’ve pretty much stated that it’s a forgone conclusion without even providing any reasons why that’s so. the arena is even subject to appeals still, and until the arena’s built and Lebron signs on the dotted line, i won’t believe it. he can remain friends with Jay-Z and not play for the Nets… he’s doing that now quite well.

if you want recent reasons that Lebron would stay in Cleveland, other than that no other franchise can offer him more money, then read here and here. i’m not going to put all my chips in the middle of the table betting that he stays, but it’s unwise to do the same betting that he leaves.

you weren’t referred to as a troll in the sense that you’re short, fat, and hairy, but in the sense that your comments here were made with the intent to provoke defensive comments from this community.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gotcha. You guys are right.

Good luck with the rest of the playoffs.

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i second that..lol..brookyl u kno..lol..u think the glamour(lol) of brooklyn gon sway lebrons thoughts?..even tho he IS frends wit jayz dnt mean he leavin..

amazing happens here

by wine_gold on May 25, 2009 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Bro, that guy was agreeing with you guys...

…and you still gotta dog on him. You guys take yourselves pretty seriously in here.

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 9:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, making attempts to spell basic English words correctly is a high standard, I know.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 9:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Some people just don't get it Brad

And, they never will.

Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on May 26, 2009 12:36 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dude...get real...it wasn't even the worst call of the game!!

…and that comes from a Magic fan…fact of the matter is whether intentional or not…the elbow made contact with the head…so they had to call something to keep order. Although strangely enough this was not the case when Rashard Lewis was clocked in the head by Delonte West’s elbow AND given the blocking foul. Anyways….hard fought game…just grateful it didn’t come down to a whistle deciding the game at the end at this point…..looking forward to Game 4!!

"if you're going to cry...go cry to your mama"

by MagikFanatic on May 25, 2009 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

So when DH throws an elbow after the play was called dead at Mo Williams yesterday, that didn’t make your list of no excuse missed calls? Going on to another teams blog to argue calls is pathetic.

by hans on May 25, 2009 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anyway, in game 1, the defense decided to double on Dwight Howard with players like Delonte West, and gamble with the Magic’s open shooters.

In game 2, the defense decided to double on Dwight Howard with players like Delonte West, and gamble with the Magic’s open shooters.

In game 3, the defense decided to double on Dwight Howard with players like Delonte West, and gamble with the Magic’s open shooters.

We can’t really control whether our guards’ shots will fall, shots they made all year long. But we can choose our defensive scheme. And this one is stupid. I take back everything nice I have ever said about Mike Brown.

by dgcambridge on May 25, 2009 12:36 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Agree completely. It’s costing you guys the series. In all honesty, there’s no reason why Delonte West or Mo Williams cannot guard Rafer Alston. Put LBJ on Turk, and make the rest of the Magic beat you guys. Play Dwight 1 on 1. Force him to get 30/40 points while taking away the perimeter pick and roll.

by CaneGrad05 on May 25, 2009 1:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This seems like a good point, Lebron not guarding one of their top scorers is pretty mind boggling. If Mike Brown is doing it to save Lebron’s energy on the offensive end it seems a bit against his whole defense comes first philosophy.

by hans on May 25, 2009 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who can guard Howard

One of the key matchup problems for the Cavs is that there is no big man who can match up well with Howard 1 on 1 either offensively or defensively.

Z offensively is a 7 3 screen 17-20 feet from the basket who can shoot an old fashion 17 set shoot (back when no one heard of the jump shot), and defensively is too slow and weak to defend Howard.

Varajou offensively is a mainly a rebound and stick back specialist. Main thing to defend him is to block him out then he is no offensive threat what so ever. Defensively is he quick enough but simply does not have the bulk to defend Howard.

Wallace offensively is a mainly a rebound guy, and like Varajou the key to defend him is to block him out. Defensively he is the only Cav who has the bulk to deal with Howard, but he is not athletic enough to handle Howard.

Probably in this case the best defense against Howard is to rotate among these three players. That is 18 fouls to give. Offensively none of the three are a threat to Howard.

Unfortunately the best defense against Howard is Howard in foul trouble.

by markclev2006 on May 25, 2009 2:13 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

honestly, it almost doesn’t matter who we put on howard. he’s going to get plenty of good looks in the post, and there’s not much we can do about that. the thing is, though, if howard had had 45 points in game 1, the cavs would have won by 15. for some reason, the cavs went away from the first half, single-team strategy in game 1, and started doubling howard. the rest is history.

let howard work in the paint, it’s our best bet.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 4:04 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I couldn’t agree more with your comment. Let me also add that intentionally fouling Howard under the basket is (usually) a bad idea as. The Cavs were in the bonus with 6 minutes to go in all four quarters, giving the Magic free throws on touch perimeter fouls and loose ball fouls. Of Turkolu’s free throws, at least 8 were when he was dribbling.

Whether Howard will make more of his free throw’s next time around is besides the point. Howard is a career 60% FT shooter. If the Cavs can’t hold the Magic under 60% true shooting, the series is over.

Not to mention the fact that when Orlando shoots free throws, it prevents our offense from getting out in transition. And with the way our offense has been playing, we need all the easy baskets we can get.

by SanD on May 25, 2009 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

My opinion

I’ve been reading and following FearTheSword for awhile, haven’t posted, but I’ve been following it, as I’m a AVID Cleveland sports, especially Cavaliers fan.

I very well believe we could be up 3-0 in this series, or at the very least, 2-1.

We came out strong in games 1 and 2, and totally disappeared in the second half in each of them.

This team needs to get back to what got them here. Nobody besides LeBron can hit a shot. The Magic defense is not that great in my opinion. Just bad shots being taken. Delonte and Mo have become way to careless with the ball. The entire team is lack-a-dasical at key moments in the game. I love Z, but he cannot hang with Howard at all in the middle. He is getting constantly man handled by him, and its embarrassing to watch and should be embarrassing for Z. Andy needs to get back to what turned him into the Wild Thing, and when someone comes flying down the lane, he needs to step up and take the charge. Sasha, although he matches up well with Hedo in size, cannot hang with him whatsoever. And Ben, grant it he’s had lots of injuries has turned into a softy. When he played in Detroit, I never saw this guy try to take a charge, and now he’s flopping all the time, especially in this series, most of the time, not getting the call. The entire bench has been non-existent. And what I also dislike, is how our guys are getting pushed around, bruised, cut, bloodied, and we just take it. This team in the regular season would, not really retaliate in a negative way, but they would let it known that they aren’t going to take any crap. This team has turned into the 2003 through 2008 Cavaliers, not the 08-09 team we’ve seen this entire year. There are plenty of more things that can be said, but I’d be here forever talking about them.

This is suppose to be OUR year, this is suppose to be OUR time, this is suppose to be OUR turn. We cannot let this Magic team, who I truly believe we are better than, steal this away from us. Its gut check time for this team, we need to step up and put the ghosts of Cleveland’s sports past behind us.

We are going to see what this team is made of on Tuesday…its do or die time and its time for these men to step up to the challenge.

by Mark23 on May 25, 2009 12:43 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Why does everyone still think Orlando's defense is overrated?

There’s a reason they were in the top 3 in nearly every defensive category.

Shaq sucks.

by Paul Finger on May 25, 2009 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Reason...

Dwight Howard.

by Mark23 on May 25, 2009 12:57 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

And so were the Cavs.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 8:17 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

so both team’s defense is overrated? no both teams play the best D in the league, this is just a hell of a match up between two awesome teams and a fun series to watch to boot

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree. Thank you for being able to complement both teams. I don’t know why so many Magic fans feel the need to come here and trash the Cavs in order to make their team look good. All the Cavs fans here respect the Magic and we all knew this would be a tough matchup for the Cavs. This has been a close series so far and I expect that to continue throughout the series.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

magic fans are used to being smitten. throughout the season not many other team blogs have given the team any respect. the sixers of all teams talked a lot of smack about us stating that they were ‘slightly better.’

i think there’s a mutual respect between these two teams and that makes this series much more enjoyable than some of the other trash talk we usually hear.

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

LBJ fell in love with his jumper tonight. What was he- 1 for 15? He scored plenty, but no rhythm to his game, and after the early misses by the teammates, he stopped penetrating and looking for them, instead choosing to pull up from 17+ way too much.

In terms of playing the best basketball, Cavs should be ahead in this series 2-1. But you have to finish games, and that’s why it’s 1-2.

by CaneGrad05 on May 25, 2009 1:20 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

...

Nobody else, imo, is really a stand out on the defensive end for the Magic.

by Mark23 on May 25, 2009 12:58 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Pietrus and Courtney Lee are pretty good defenders. Not stand out I guess, but they do a good job. The rest of the team plays excellent help defense, and they get back and find shooters in transition to limit easy baskets and mismatches. That’s all you really need to do when you have a strong defensive presence underneath the basket.

by CaneGrad05 on May 25, 2009 1:15 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

the magic’s defense is quite good, you’re right. stan van gundy does a very good job of gameplanning, and the players execute rather well…i wish i could say the same for the cavs’ defense this series.

that said, though, we’ve missed an awful lot of makeable shots.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 4:08 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Right. How many wide open shots did Mo and Delonte miss? Not to mention Gibson’s only shot, a missed 3 with nobody within 10 feet of him.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’m wondering where Wally will be for the rest of the series. The Sasha thing really didn’t do much in the last game and his lack of consistent playing at the end of the season (and probably in practices during the playoffs) has left him making some dumb mistakes. The worst for the Cavs to do is to be too reactive here. I’d like to see Wally get some time.

by hans on May 25, 2009 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pietrus is known as a good defender.

Even when he was with Golden State. I think he did a good job against LeBron (well, at least better than most people I’ve seen).

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cavs looking for answers.

Clevland and Orlando are both 0 forever as far as winning an N.B.A. championship. The Championship team will come out of the west. Those are the facts PERIOD.

by Celtics9Lakers2 on May 25, 2009 2:22 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Nah

If the Nuggets come out on top in the West, there’s no way they are beating the Cavs or the Magic. Lakers are a different story though.

Welcome to Smashville, Tennessee.
Official Graphic Designer/Researcher of MCM.

Proud iPhone user. Take that, Jim Balls.

by Aditya T (smashville) on May 25, 2009 2:29 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

the nuggets are 0-for-forever, too. snag a clue on your way out.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 4:08 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, like that has to do with anything this year.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

boo

stupid comment

let some other teams in the league!

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The answer for the Cavs is to get back to drive to the basket offense

Watching game 3, I noticed the Cavs were settling for far too many jump shots. Especially a lot of shots taken with no teammates within 10 feet of the basket.

The Cavs are at their best when LeBron and Williams are driving to the basket and either shooting or dishing. This opens up the outside shooting, creates foul opportunities, but more importantly enables players like Varejou offensive opportunities to score. Every point Varejou, Wallace, and Z scores is a bonus. Varejou, Wallace, and Z can not create offensive opportunities on their own. This is also a method for taking the scoring burden off of LeBron, getting more players involved in the offense which puts a burden on Orlandos offense, and more times than not results in a higher percentage shot.

Settling for the long range jumper which is what most of the Cavs were settling for today was a gift to the Orlando defense. Especially tonight when most shots were not falling.

The only player I saw who was at least trying to drive was West. He still could not make his shot but least it resulted in him taking a 12 feet shot as opposed to a 20 feet shot.

by markclev2006 on May 25, 2009 2:48 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Is it fair to say LeBron looked tired last night?

And that’s why he was settling for jumpers and not taking it to the hole? Obviously he’s amazing, but maybe blowing out Detroit and Atlanta with the support he has has left him without enough in the tank to carry them through another series (especially their most evenly-matched series). No longer trolling, just wondering. Fact is I enjoy watching LeBron play more than any other super star to date.

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

we’ve really not even attempted to execute much in the pick and roll on the offensive end this series, which confuses the hell out of me. how many dunks/layups has varejao gotten against the magic? that was a hallmark of our offense when it was clicking both in the reg season and the first two rounds.

the magic have done a great job of taking us out of our comfort zone offensively. we’ve not responded…just kind of wilted.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 4:11 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

having said that, even in spite of the good defense the magic have played, mo williams and delonte west are costing the cavs this series. their complete inability to execute, to make shots, to take care of the ball, things they’ve done all year, is killing this team. it’s all on them, quite frankly. it’s a pretty legendary disappearing act.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 4:35 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Really guys....

……you should stop drinking the Kool-Ade….

The FT numbers were the result of the Cavs fouling Howard (part of their game plan) and the Magic just being quicker to the spots. Why would Orlando even want to foul Williams, West, Z, Flopsie, et.al. they had each and every one of them under control.

Waiting on LeBron and the Cavs

by Brutalfacts on May 25, 2009 8:36 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Uhhh…..he’s a Magic fan and he’s agreeing with you.

Also, don’t use the phrase “drinking the Kool-Aid”. That’s idiot-talk.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You sure like to trash on people that don't agree with you huh?

"The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over."

by GonzoFan on May 25, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

No, I love discussing basketball intelligently with opposing fans. I don’t like people who make idiotic statement and try to start arguments.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

if you believe that every time Howard went to the line, the foul was intentional, then you read the boxscore but didn’t watch the game.

and the argument has always been that the Cavs are receiving the calls from the refs, not that they’re receiving a disproportionate amount of the calls. Game 1 saw a PF count of Cavs 19, Magic 15 and Game 2 was Cavs 24, Magic 25. I can’t look back and see how many fouls were called for Howard shooting, but subtracting his free throws puts that total at 32-33, but you can subtract the extra FTs awarded to the Cavs for 1 flagrant and 1 tech on the Magic.

Nobody here is saying the Cavs are getting cheated by the refs… we’re saying the Magic aren’t getting cheated. To view the Magic at some sort of officiating disadvantage is preemptively establishing an excuse that your team doesn’t need.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ohc,

replying to your post might have not been the right place to put this, but I couldn’t be sure which point you were trying to make.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who said....

…we need an excuse. From what I have watched and seen nothing that has to do with the FT thing has come from the Magic. Stan stayed away from it last night, Dwight stayed away from it last night. Of course those rock ribbed Magic homers from TNT, NBATV, and the media have come down on this, but as we expected they sided with the Magic. Not unexpected of course, we all know that David Stern, Nike and of course ABC will do everything in their power to prevent a Cavs-Lakers final. I mean….who wants that?

Waiting on LeBron and the Cavs

by Brutalfacts on May 25, 2009 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

nobody said you needed an excuse.

To view the Magic at some sort of officiating disadvantage is preemptively establishing an excuse that your team doesn’t need.

you see what you want to read, instead of actually comprehending what’s there.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It’s funny that a guy who calls himself “Brutalfacts” tends to ignore the facts and just make up things to support his opinion.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it might be

because of the calls that were going against us in the last series and that we’re still sore from actually being raped by the officials when we played the celtics.

i think both teams are being cheated by the nba and it’s inability to make consistent calls. there is a sliding scale for what is and what isn’t this season and nobody is happy.

Nah' mean, nah'm sayin

by Dr Things on May 25, 2009 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i can completely understand that. as in any sport, possibly baseball more than the others, you’d at least want the refs/umps/officials to be consistent, even if they’re consistently bad because then you can adjust to the way they’re calling games. when they start becoming more aggressive or more lax with their whistleblowing, that’s when it waters down the competition between the two teams.

You know Selig? Ombudsman.

by rolub on May 25, 2009 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i’m a big believer in the concept of gross offsetting errors when it comes to officiating. the refs are not good, mostly b/c refereeing an nba game has to be one of the hardest things to do that i can imagine, but i think they are not good pretty equally in each direction.

by DontCallMeJoey on May 25, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just wanted to say as a Magic fan, that I have enjoyed reading your blog and all of your ideas. The games have been very close, last nights game was closer than it appeared at the end.
Lebron James is a monster offensively and defensively. Just like Jordan, and Kobe, superstars like Lebron are going to get the benefit of whistles in any shadow of doubt. It’s just something you come to expect.

With all due respect to everyone here, I think that the Magic are a really, really good team. I don’t think their team defense gets enough credit on this blog. Saying that West, Williams, and Z are just missing shots (while true) doesn’t paint the complete picture. The Cavs seem totally out of rythym, and that doesn’t just happen by missing shots. Courtney Lee is one heck of a defender. I’ve watched him all year, and he’s played huge against all the superstars in this league, and done an incredible job, especially as a rookie. Pietrus has been solid on d for us too, but his offense has been clutch in the playoffs.

The main thing I wanted to ask of you guys is that I don’t see a lot of plays being run by the Cavs. Is this normal? I understand transition and everything, but the last two games, it has just appeared to be more like street ball. Iso’s and one on one. This causes the flow of the game to be fragmented. When I watched the Celtics play the Magic, there were tons and tons of plays called for different people with screens being set all over the place. All I’ve seen recently is Lebron James handling the ball all the time, driving. shooting, or sometimes passing the ball off late in the shot clock.
If that’s the set plays that the Cavs are drawing up in the locker room, someone better get some new chalk.

Good luck in game 4!!

by darylglen on May 25, 2009 11:11 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I can’t disagree with anything you’ve said here. The Magic certainly deserve credit for the way they’ve played on D, but the things is we’ve had a lot of open shot opportunities that we’ve failed to capitalize on.

Thanks for stopping by and playing nice, though. We really appreciate when opposing fans can come over here and talk good basketball talk without being obnoxious. Kudos, and good luck to you as well in game 4.

I'm *always* in the driver's seat, cugino -- Chuck

by Turkmenbashi on May 25, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree. I appreciate a Magic fan who wants to talk basketball without feeling the need to trash talk and constantly put down the Cavs. I wish other Magic fans here would take note.

by Buckeye Brad on May 25, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is well said. I’ll add that, while Mo and Delonte have missed more than their share of open shots, the Magic have done a good job of taking away the offense they’ve created for themselves all season. Delonte got it going a little bit in the third quarter of Game 3, but he was making very difficult shots. All credit goes to Alston and Lee and Howard guarding the rim.

When commentors on this site mention the “2006 Offense,” they are talking about no plays, no screens, Isos, Lebron going 1 v 5, etc. In the first quarters of Game 1 and 2, the Cavs have run their “2008 offense” but either they are abandoning it or the Magic have made adjustments and are preventing the Cavs from running it.

by SanD on May 25, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Cavaliers intentionally fouled Howard.

They also fouled intentionally towards the end of the game, so pointing out the FTA is misleading.

by redzero on May 25, 2009 2:33 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Thanks Guys.

Now I understand what the 2006 offense comments are about. In looking at all the playoff games over the past few days, both East and West (and I promise I’m not trying to be biased), but the Magic seem to be the only team still running plays constantly. The Denver/Laker series looks like street ball too.

It just seems to me that the team that executes more down the stretch will win the series. Raw, pure talent will keep you in the game, and may even win you one or two. But to pin your hopes all on street ball seems assinine to me this far in the playoffs.

But again, it’s been a pleasure to watch the Cavs this postseason, and I truly wish you guys well. Of course, I hope you lose!! But it’s only basketball!!

by darylglen on May 25, 2009 2:53 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Fouls

I am a diehard MAGIC FAN, hence the name. I just want to shed a different light on the Foul calling arena. My beef isn’t that the calls aren’t being called consistently, but that it’s hard for me to believe that the man who was 2nd in Defensive Player of the year voting gets so little calls called on him. Now, I know some of the argument, he’s so big he gets beat up all the time. That was SHAQ’s argument or the one against him, b/c he’s so big and strong. But isn’t a foul a foul? It’s just amazing that someone who is involved in so many plays and so good defensively does it so cleanly. Of course just my perception.

by Flmagic on May 25, 2009 10:50 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

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